What do you think about Socialist countries Politics and governments

Here we were able to criticize covid policy, even if it was like talking with agressive crowd with torches, and the doctors with different opinion had hard times because of the Health institutions, like suing and blackmailing.

I'd say that if you have to fear for your job and your social life, then freedom of speech isn't fully realized and, on the contrary, you are near the border to just get your mouth shut by popular vindictiveness. Many people now in the West won't express some ideas because of the fear to be socially isolated.

And finally I see more talking about Poland's membership in UE, even coming from some government's members. Generally critizing UE is common here, but I believe You know that if You follow the infos about tensions between us.

I've seen some from Poland a little, but yet again, those are ridiculed and if it comes to Polan, in the West, it will be said that you've no reason to complain considering the money you receive.

And in US it's also not so bad. You can be ignored in one tv station, but thanks to the states level of autonomy, debate there and possible actions for both sides are still on competetive level, when we talk about law's solutions.

I don't know the US enough, yet I'd be suspiscious when I see how the country is going and how the people there are behaving.

it's sad and worrying, if You tells me that yellow jackets has been ignored by gov completely. You seems to have one of the most brutal protests in france, after all. Or maybe it's just picture in tv.

Usually, depicting a movement as violent is useful to discredit the said movement and to justify violent response. I think that you should know that in Poland for I remember your whole country was labeled as racist and fascist for celebrating your national day, focusing on a very small group of people whereas most of people there were normal families.

About Russia - i don't know how it looks like in other countries, but in Poland, our gov is abusing the topic. They are like drunk of unbrainless actions aimed at Russia, and help for Ukraine.

I've indeed seen Poland being very pushy, to the point it looked like if they were fully confident on article 5 (like if POland didn't get betrayed by the west once). In some other countries, it might be not to this extent, but the topic is abused too. Ukraine is fully supported, Russia is banned and Russians sometimes victims of racism. The whole war is just a tool here though, to justify a so called inflation and the fall of euro, despite those problems were already present before the begining of the year.

As for Russians, normal people there get punished as well for nothing. I thought it was illegal to take a people as hostage to make a government comply, but apparently not.

Still, compare debate and protests scale and consequences of it, in the "west" countries and "east" countries. Im still glued to my opinion.

Both diarrhea and "well shaped" turd are shit though.

Lianshen, I mostly agree with you than with Oxiu. But he also has some points. I would say that capitalism or socialism is not a guarantee of freedom. I am sure that in China somewhere there are some problems with freedom of speech etc, but the problem is that politicians are using these problems. Do we have problems of speech in France? Yes, we do. In Russia for example many people are criticizing Putin. So, does it mean we have a democracy in Russia? And by the way, Russia is a capitalist country. I guess in North Korea people can't criticize their government. Anyway, it was probably true a long time ago, that socialist countries had less freedom. But I am not so sure today. Probably it doesn't matter. Some socialist countries have more freedom than have capitalist countries and vice versa.

My bad if I didn't express myself properly, but I share those ideas.

"Can you ever ‘solve’ poverty? Can you ever ‘solve’ crime? Can you ever ‘solve’ disease, unemployment, war or any other societal herpes? Hell no. All you can hope for is to make them manageable enough to allow people to get on with their lives. That’s not cynicism, that’s maturity. You can’t stop the rain. All you can do is just build a roof that you hope won’t leak, or at least won’t leak on the people who are going to vote for you’." This is neoliberal ideology in action. It is no longer the responsibility of the state to work towards the greatest good of the greatest number through the administration of justice, the alleviation of poverty and the provision of healthcare, education and welfare. Politicians serve not the people but the elite and are entirely unabashed in so doing. It redefines citizens as "consumers", whose "democratic choices" are best exercised by buying and selling, a process that rewards merit and punishes inefficiency. The organisation of labour and collective bargaining by trade unions are portrayed as market distortions that impede the formation of a natural hierarchy of winners and losers. Inequality is recast as virtuous: a reward for utility and a generator of wealth, which trickles down to enrich everyone. Efforts to create a more equal society are both counterproductive and morally corrosive. The market ensures that everyone gets what they deserve. Never mind structural unemployment: if you don’t have a job it’s because you are unenterprising. Never mind the impossible costs of housing: if your credit card is maxed out, you’re feckless and improvident. Never mind that your children no longer have a school playing field: if they get fat, it’s your fault. In a world governed by competition, those who fall behind become defined and self-defined as losers.

It may seem strange that a doctrine promising choice and freedom should have been promoted with the slogan “there is no alternative”. But, as Hayek remarked on a visit to Pinochet’s Chile – one of the first nations in which the programme was comprehensively applied – “my personal preference leans toward a liberal dictatorship rather than toward a democratic government devoid of liberalism”. The freedom that neoliberalism offers, which sounds so beguiling when expressed in general terms, turns out to mean freedom for the pike, not for the minnows.

Freedom from trade unions and collective bargaining means the freedom to suppress wages. Freedom from regulation means the freedom to poison rivers, endanger workers, charge iniquitous rates of interest and design exotic financial instruments. Freedom from tax means freedom from the distribution of wealth that lifts people out of poverty.

The greater the failure, the more extreme the ideology becomes. Governments use neoliberal crises as both excuse and opportunity to cut taxes, privatise remaining public services, rip holes in the social safety net, deregulate corporations and re-regulate citizens. The self-hating state now sinks its teeth into every organ of the public sector.

Perhaps the most dangerous impact of neoliberalism is not the economic crises it has caused, but the political crisis. Fascist movements build their base not from the politically active but the politically inactive, the ‘losers’ who feel, often correctly, they have no voice or role to play in the political establishment.

Like communism, neoliberalism is the God that failed. But the zombie doctrine staggers on, and one of the reasons is its anonymity. Or rather, a cluster of anonymities. The invisible doctrine of the invisible hand is promoted by invisible backers. It is "The Road to Serfdom" and we still think that we have much more "freedom" than the others. No time to criticise it since we are all distracted as playing the life in "casino capitalism." Yet it is ratherl easier to swear on the ghost of "socialism." Period.

Is this analysis from you, or is it a quotation? Anyway, thanks for sharing, it was interesting to read.

Thanks for your other answer about Uyghurs, it's better written and more knowledgeable than I am on the topic. On this, I think a comparison that could be drawn, certainly a bit clumsy, would eb to compare it with the independence of Egypt and the conflict around Suez canal that drew inspiration to some other countries, including Algeria.

Why China's reputation looks so bad in the world? Just because we are a socialist country?

I suppose it's partly for this reason, but also because chinese words are tricky and doesn't match its action. China's presence in Africa or in Europe is all but mutual respect and non-interference. It actually looks more like neo-colonialism. It's not a blame though, other countries do the same, especially if they have the ability to.

Maybe you’re referring to Pinochet coming into power? No I don’t call that democracy. I call that a coup.

Pinochet came to power with the support of the US and was not a communist at all,quite the opposite...

Thanks for your answer, your point of view will trigger some thoughts for me. In fact in my country there are some of people think Americans and Europeans are stupid, at least are unfair. Sometimes we are inevitably biased because of our subjective positions. But after reading some points here I learned more about what drive to people live in different territory make different choices deeply. I can't say I like your point of view, but I genuinely like it this way, and your earnest answer makes me want to thank you for your courtesy.

Why China's reputation looks so bad in the world? Just because we are a socialist country?

I suppose it's partly for this reason, but also because chinese words are tricky and doesn't match its action. China's presence in Africa or in Europe is all but mutual respect and non-interference. It actually looks more like neo-colonialism. It's not a blame though, other countries do the same, especially if they have the ability to.

Maybe you’re referring to Pinochet coming into power? No I don’t call that democracy. I call that a coup.

Pinochet came to power with the support of the US and was not a communist at all,quite the opposite...

Thanks for your answer, your point of view will trigger some thoughts for me. In fact in my country there are some of people think Americans and Europeans are stupid, at least are unfair. Sometimes we are inevitably biased because of our subjective positions. But after reading some points here I learned more about what drive to people live in different territory make different choices deeply. I can't say I like your point of view, but I genuinely like it this way, and your earnest answer makes me want to thank you for your courtesy.

Accusing you of having neo-colonial tendencies and some dishonest propaganda is also the view of some netizens on our side. It's interesting in a sense.

Why China's reputation looks so bad in the world? Just because we are a socialist country?

I suppose it's partly for this reason, but also because chinese words are tricky and doesn't match its action. China's presence in Africa or in Europe is all but mutual respect and non-interference. It actually looks more like neo-colonialism. It's not a blame though, other countries do the same, especially if they have the ability to.

Maybe you’re referring to Pinochet coming into power? No I don’t call that democracy. I call that a coup.

Pinochet came to power with the support of the US and was not a communist at all,quite the opposite...

Thanks for your answer, your point of view will trigger some thoughts for me. In fact in my country there are some of people think Americans and Europeans are stupid, at least are unfair. Sometimes we are inevitably biased because of our subjective positions. But after reading some points here I learned more about what drive to people live in different territory make different choices deeply. I can't say I like your point of view, but I genuinely like it this way, and your earnest answer makes me want to thank you for your courtesy.

Accusing you of having neo-colonial tendencies and some dishonest propaganda is also the view of some netizens on our side. It's interesting in a sense.

Some parts of Africa still use francs or speak French, which has aroused the suspicion of some netizens in my country. They make a unfriendly nickname as former emperor of west Africa for France. Hope these words don't offend you, this is just sharing a phenomenon, I apologize in advance if it's inappropriate. At the same time, I'm sorry to talk about a lot of things that are not related to the topic, I just think this similarity is worth continuing to explore.

Now I understand more about why Western people confirm people who live in socialist countries are not free, authoritarian, extreme and brainwashed, more or less. I am not sure I can express my idea clearly so I want to use an example. Recently the U.S. overruled Roe V. Wade case which drew so much attention to women's abortion rights in China. Some people believe the U.S. is extreme, anti-intellectual, divied and brainwashed by religious power. As a girl who lives in atheist country all the time, although I know beliving the god exists may bring people hope and teach them love in theory, in the heart I can't accept my country will be like that and I can't understand those who are devoutly religious, only I can do is showing my respect and hoping things will be all right. Maybe because we can't turly understand others who live in too different environment. Everyone is brainwashed, just by different things. In a more positive way, maybe we can say everyone has their own beliefs.

I have read a Japanese novel called River Without Bridge, some know that they are brainwashed and want to change, and some do not.
I think the most difficult thing is that tout le monde a raison. But it is also the most interesting thing.
We should be happy that there exist so many different societies and different theories.

Are we all damned to fight with each other forever? What is all these nonsense about? Who cares, is it a communist state or not? Are we humans or animals? What we are fighting for? Human rights? Really? Is it all about human rights? I don't think so.

I maid re-post about Julien Assange, anybody cares? No! We are talking about nonsense. Russia and China is now the topic. Can somebody tell me why? It's an interests of the certain clans. Who cares about human rights? Don't be funny. It's a very cinical world we are living in.

Are we all damned to fight with each other forever? What is all these nonsense about? Who cares, is it a communist state or not? Are we humans or animals? What we are fighting for? Human rights? Really? Is it all about human rights? I don't think so.

Each and every one of the current systems, use "otherness" for keeping its mass consolidated. Showing "the other" as boogeyman at doorsteps, is the best practice. Fear keeps the "herd" all together. We may consider it as "wolf guarding the herd", because such a parochialism leads one to prejudice and yet worse, arrogance. That is why entire topic sounds like a perfect cacaphony of arrogance.

China, NK, US and Russia are all very bogus states in my opinion. The day they learn how to behave will be the day that world peace would reign. I am NOT saying my country is innocent, but the above listed countries have crossed the line.

All I can say, this war could be stopped in a moment! But nobody wants to stop it. Everybody wants have some profit. War is a continuation of politics. There are some guys who are interested in this war.

It's all about interests of the West and East. Russia and China are going to clame on their own interests, but they are not in the interests of West. What can be done? West is not going to give up. Who would do? But why they are not talking to each other? Is there a chance to find some common grounds? Eventually they have to come to some agreements. But when? Until then many Europeans might feel the pain. They will have to suffer shortage of gas and other things. Why? Because they have to show some solidarity with the USA. It's a circle of amazing stupidity. Everybody wants to win! And everybody thinks that he will win, but not the other guy.

Who is familiar with the term "Wumao"?

Who is familiar with the term "Wumao"?

Chinese trolls? Often, it is a little bit overused.

Why China's reputation looks so bad in the world? Just because we are a socialist country?

I suppose it's partly for this reason, but also because chinese words are tricky and doesn't match its action. China's presence in Africa or in Europe is all but mutual respect and non-interference. It actually looks more like neo-colonialism. It's not a blame though, other countries do the same, especially if they have the ability to.

Maybe you’re referring to Pinochet coming into power? No I don’t call that democracy. I call that a coup.

Pinochet came to power with the support of the US and was not a communist at all,quite the opposite...

Thanks for your answer, your point of view will trigger some thoughts for me. In fact in my country there are some of people think Americans and Europeans are stupid, at least are unfair. Sometimes we are inevitably biased because of our subjective positions. But after reading some points here I learned more about what drive to people live in different territory make different choices deeply. I can't say I like your point of view, but I genuinely like it this way, and your earnest answer makes me want to thank you for your courtesy.

Accusing you of having neo-colonial tendencies and some dishonest propaganda is also the view of some netizens on our side. It's interesting in a sense.

Well, that's why I said any country who has the power to will do the same as China. France is no exception and tries to work for its interests (well, for the interests of its billionaires...).
Your words didn't offend me the least, no worries.

Some people believe the U.S. is extreme, anti-intellectual, divied and brainwashed by religious power.

Religious? I don't know if the US is very religious (or their religion is neoliberalism/king dollar/apple..?), but for the rest, it sures want to divide and brainwash the people, partly by intellectual means. That's not even a secret and it's an ideology shared by the whole Occident if not most/all the leaders. The funniest is that this is ideology is public and that leaders won't hesitate to remind that the pleb is made of a bunch of stupid people.

As a girl who lives in atheist country all the time, although I know beliving the god exists may bring people hope and teach them love in theory, in the heart I can't accept my country will be like that and I can't understand those who are devoutly religious, only I can do is showing my respect and hoping things will be all right.

If the religion is kind of neoliberalism, then China already adopted that religion, but in a different way that the US did. Chineses people already are very consumerists and paying a lot attention to money from what I've seen. They are also more consumerists than European people in my opinion, for the ones who can buy stuff, obviously.
As for being devoutly religious, well, some people are educated this way, but it would be wrong to take the US as an example in this case... US people who are religious are mostly protestants, and of a special kind at taht. You won't find the same behaviour in catholicism, or even in some branch of protestantism in Europe. You could also see extremism among the atheists as well, although it is hard to reach a certain level...

Maybe because we can't turly understand others who live in too different environment.

Well, I suppose it would be fine if the Occident understood that...

Wumao refers to a lot of Chinese people online who seek to derail conversations about China.
Wumao doesn't mean Chinese trolls exactly. It means something like "50 Cent Army". This refers to the army being paid to do that.
Maybe it's more like 7 cents in Euro in USD because of the difference in currency values.
I don't know if it's overused, I'd not heard it until recently.
I'm sure plenty of Chinese come on and make honest arguments, but if they use the same kind of tactics or rhetoric then why wouldn't it get used for them?